Reconstruction talk:Proto-Slavic/orǫdьje

Heterogentic origin?

Is it certain that all descendants stem from the same source? The meanings don't seem to align:

• East and South Slavic descendants alternate between:
  • instrumental noun with meaning “instrument, device, tool” → “weapon” (Russian орудие (orudije), Serbo-Croatian оруђе, Bulgarian оръдие (orǎdie), Albanian orëndi)
  • action/resultant noun with meaning “deed, achievement, affair” (Old Church Slavonic орѫдьѥ (orǫdĭje), Old East Slavic орудиѥ (orudije), Ukrainian оруда (oruda))
• West Slavic instead points towards:
  • abstract noun with semantics “contract, message, declaration” (Polish orędzie).

The first semantic nuance has parallels in e-ablaut terms, hence is probably native: e.g. Bulgarian уред (ured, “device”), уредба (uredba, “configuration”), Polish narzędzie (“instrument”), etc. On the other hand, Stefan Michael Newerkla (apparently following Uhlenbeck, Vaillant, Matzenauer) considers the abstract meaning a borrowing from Germanic: Czech orudie < "Ač. orudie ‘Auftrag, Angelegenheit’ wie aksl. orǫdije < ahd. ārunti, ārundi (-ren-, -rin-) ‘Botschaft, Auftrag, Angelegenheit’. Nicht zu verwechseln mit homonymem ač. orudie ‘Gerät, Instrument, Waffe, etc.’ < ursl. *orǫdьje zu ursl. *rędъ". [See the source provided by Useigor.] Безименен (talk) 22:32, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

@Bezimenen: English gear has more or less all the meanings. Mail messages contain business affairs. Both a letter and a weapon were an important thing born near the body/heart (anyway even and metaphorically in so far as they were not materialized but only memorized). I could probably find Semitic examples of the same constellation if I really wanted to. Fay Freak (talk) 23:17, 14 February 2022 (UTC)