Talk:մշուշ
Latest comment: 5 years ago by Vahagn Petrosyan
Compare Kurdish, Zazaki miž "fog".--Calak (talk) 11:57, 18 April 2019 (UTC)
- @Calak, that comparison has already been made by J̌ahukyan, but rejected by Martirosyan. See մուժ (muž) and Martirosyan 2010, page 472. --Vahag (talk) 13:44, 18 April 2019 (UTC)
- The Assyrian Neo-Aramaic ܡܝܫ (miš, “fog, mist”) compared by Ačaṙyan looks like a borrowing from that Kurdish word. --Vahag (talk) 14:05, 18 April 2019 (UTC)
- Yes, can you check it in Napiorkowska book?--Calak (talk) 14:07, 18 April 2019 (UTC)
- She agrees with us. --Vahag (talk) 14:28, 18 April 2019 (UTC)
- Yes, can you check it in Napiorkowska book?--Calak (talk) 14:07, 18 April 2019 (UTC)
How can we explain Arm u from OIr. mayga- (> MIr. mēg)?--Calak (talk) 20:05, 18 April 2019 (UTC)
- I suppose you are referring to u in մուժ (muž). It is recorded only in the dialect of Bitlis and as մուժ-իկ (muž-ik) in Kharberd. It is more common in the form մըժ (məž), recorded in several Western Armenian dialects. I am inclined to explain both forms as borrowings from Kurdish mij, muj and Zazaki mıj. Is the Kurdish u regular from OIr. ay? Also aren't the Iranian u ~ i forms better explained from PIE *h₃mígʰ-s in *h₃meygʰ-? Also pinging @Victar.
- If nevertheless an inner-Armenian explanation is sought, I would offer two tentative solutions: (1) a back-formation from մժ-իկ (mž-ik), (2) influence of մշուշ (mšuš) and աղջամուղջ (aġǰamuġǰ). --Vahag (talk) 08:11, 19 April 2019 (UTC)
- Compare Kurdish muj (from OIr. mayga-, whence OArm. mēg) with NK. tûj (from OIr. tayga-, whence OArm. tēg). Kurdish mij should be from weak root of mai̯ga- (i.e. miga-).--Calak (talk) 08:42, 19 April 2019 (UTC)
- Then I am ready to declare մուժ (muž) / մըժ (məž) a Kurdish borrowing. Apart from phonetic considerations, let us note that in Armenian dialects the word is confined to Kurdish-influenced areas. The borrowing of the same into Assyrian Neo-Aramaic ܡܝܫ (miš) and dialectal Turkish mij (Van, Arčeš) is also notable. Now I wonder if the city name Մուշ (Muš) is related. Folk etymology connects it with մշուշ (mšuš, “fog”), because Mush Plain is often covered in fog. --Vahag (talk) 09:30, 19 April 2019 (UTC)
- Compare Kurdish muj (from OIr. mayga-, whence OArm. mēg) with NK. tûj (from OIr. tayga-, whence OArm. tēg). Kurdish mij should be from weak root of mai̯ga- (i.e. miga-).--Calak (talk) 08:42, 19 April 2019 (UTC)