Talk:炸彈
Latest comment: 4 years ago by Atitarev in topic Hakka pfs
Hakka pfs[edit]
@Mar vin kaiser: Hi. You have added Hakka pfs reading in diff as "cha-thàn" but [1] only has "cha-tan". --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:17, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Atitarev: Hi. I got it from here [2]. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 00:47, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser: Thanks. If this dictionary is also trustworthy, it should be ""cha-tàn"", not "cha-thàn"? What's the meaning of 四, 海, 大, etc. here? --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:53, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Atitarev: In this source, the correct one is "cha-thàn", you can hear the aspiration in the recording, and there are settings there to switch the romanization to PFS, and it will show "cha-thàn". Yes, this is trustworthy, as this is a government-run website that regulates Taiwanese Hakka. As for the 四, 海, 大, they refer to different subdialects of Hakka in Taiwan. 四 is for the Sixian dialect, 海 for Hailu dialect, 大 for Dapu dialect, 平 for Raoping dialect, 安 for Zhao'an dialect, and 南 for South Sixian dialect. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 01:00, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser, Justinrleung, Suzukaze-c OK. [3] has been considered accurate for PFS. It gives "thàn" for "彈" but "cha-tan" for "炸彈". How do we reconcile? Is it a mistake in hakka.fhl.net? Justin and Suzukaze, please join. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:10, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- I can't say anything about Hakka. —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 01:13, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Atitarev: Cha-thàn is probably the more common pronunciation. Moedict takes its data from 臺灣客家語常用詞辭典, which is the Hakka dictionary published by Taiwan's MoE, so it's reliable. (I usually check the actual website of 臺灣客家語常用詞辭典 to make sure it's up to date since it gets updated once in a while.) Note that the romanization used in this dictionary is the Hakka Romanization System, whose t corresponds to th in PFS. The recording here for Sixian Hakka (read first in Northern Sixian and then in Southern Sixian) also has cha-thàn. The reporter in this video also reads it as cha-thàn. 徐兆泉's dictionary (available here for download as a Word document) also has za tan (= cha-thàn). This 客語字典 is also usually reliable, so I think it's ok to keep cha-tan as an alternative pronunciation (but it's probably influenced by Mandarin dàn, cf. 旦 = Mandarin dàn = Hakka tan). Thàn is related to Mandarin tán, which is not used in Mandarin for 炸彈. — justin(r)leung { (t...) | c=› } 04:16, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- Thank you, all! --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 05:10, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Atitarev: Cha-thàn is probably the more common pronunciation. Moedict takes its data from 臺灣客家語常用詞辭典, which is the Hakka dictionary published by Taiwan's MoE, so it's reliable. (I usually check the actual website of 臺灣客家語常用詞辭典 to make sure it's up to date since it gets updated once in a while.) Note that the romanization used in this dictionary is the Hakka Romanization System, whose t corresponds to th in PFS. The recording here for Sixian Hakka (read first in Northern Sixian and then in Southern Sixian) also has cha-thàn. The reporter in this video also reads it as cha-thàn. 徐兆泉's dictionary (available here for download as a Word document) also has za tan (= cha-thàn). This 客語字典 is also usually reliable, so I think it's ok to keep cha-tan as an alternative pronunciation (but it's probably influenced by Mandarin dàn, cf. 旦 = Mandarin dàn = Hakka tan). Thàn is related to Mandarin tán, which is not used in Mandarin for 炸彈. — justin(r)leung { (t...) | c=› } 04:16, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- I can't say anything about Hakka. —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 01:13, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser, Justinrleung, Suzukaze-c OK. [3] has been considered accurate for PFS. It gives "thàn" for "彈" but "cha-tan" for "炸彈". How do we reconcile? Is it a mistake in hakka.fhl.net? Justin and Suzukaze, please join. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:10, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Atitarev: In this source, the correct one is "cha-thàn", you can hear the aspiration in the recording, and there are settings there to switch the romanization to PFS, and it will show "cha-thàn". Yes, this is trustworthy, as this is a government-run website that regulates Taiwanese Hakka. As for the 四, 海, 大, they refer to different subdialects of Hakka in Taiwan. 四 is for the Sixian dialect, 海 for Hailu dialect, 大 for Dapu dialect, 平 for Raoping dialect, 安 for Zhao'an dialect, and 南 for South Sixian dialect. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 01:00, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser: Thanks. If this dictionary is also trustworthy, it should be ""cha-tàn"", not "cha-thàn"? What's the meaning of 四, 海, 大, etc. here? --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:53, 1 July 2019 (UTC)